Topic: Chinese porcelain plaque

[Martyn]

No posts here yet so heres one to fill up the blank space.

Chinese porcelain plaque...64cm x 26cm x 1.5cm (25in x 10in x 1/2in) I believe to be early 20th century....

I posted it on another forum and heres what was said there....

This is a great example of the 'gongbi' style of Chinese painting characterised by fine brushwork and attention to detail.

The seals do not give any indication of the artist's name - rather they are a poetic statement, which doesn't seem to have much relevance to the painting.

The top seal is the most mysterious. The characters read 'long ming feng yin wan shan' (dragon, close eyes, rely on, seal, whole, mountain) The 'wan' character may be a short form for another 'wan' which refers to Anhui province, but that doesn't make much more sense. I get the feeling that as there are only six characters in the seal, the artist may have left one out when he painted the image, as the second seal has seven characters, and a much better structure.

It reads 'mei hua shi dao zi ran xiang', meaning something like "when it's plum blossom time, you can appreciate its true fragrance."

Neither of which gives any hint as to the artist or the time.

courtesy of mikeoz

It's a bit broken but still very beautiful I think, if anyone can add any more info that would be great.

[Martyn]

It's roughly 2 x 1 foot (in cm at top of post) saddly its broken in four pieces which I stuck back together so I could see and store it better. The detail is great and the pigs' very characterful, the flowers are even a bit 'retro' dont you think  ...here's a pic of the back which shows the damage more clearly.

[Collectiques]

Its just gorgeous ...

I have a number of chinese or japanese things I really wouldnt have a clue about... so I tend to put them to one side and think one day I'll get around the finding out more...this site is already motivating me to finally solve a few mysteries...which is just great

[Martyn]

Thanks...

Do post some pieces, we collect a lot of Japanese studio ceramics but like you finding out much about them is hard work. Despite there being a huge cross fertalization of ideas between Japanese and western studio potters throughout the 20th century there seems to be very little in English either published or on the net. Hopefully we can build this forum up and attract in some specialists to contribute a little to everyones knowledge.

[Pete]

Good luck with that, Martyn
I think they are already at Gotheborg which is an enormous site. Guys who read Chinese / Japanese; who know their dynasties inside out and backwards, who can spot the many many styles and discern the extremely convincing fakes.
Oriental pottery and porcelain has to be the most difficult, complex and least accessible of collecting fields and even experts need to consult with experts. I don't mean to be negative but if I were an expert in this, I know where I would spend my time. We would need something very very special to lure them away. I have no idea what that would be. Yes they do have a large forum, segmented into specialisms - access by subscription only !
I love the simplicity of Japanese forms and to trace work which inspired Leach for example would be fascinating but realistically for me I can't see it happening. Already so involved as I am with glass all I can hope to do is tinker around the edges of ceramics in general, though I will contribute in whatever small way I can.
Pete

[Martyn]

Hi Pete,

Maybe I sounded niave?...I dont expect a exodus from Gotheborg or any of the other specialist forum or an instant answer so I can list it on ebay, but I see no reason why people with an interest in and knowledge of oriental ceramics should'nt join this forum and share thier experience. (no reason other than greed or vanity that is)

I've had this piece for a number of years and I've asked Christies about it, some Chinese ceramic dealer friends and posted it on another specialist forum, each of them added a little to my understanding and appreciation of it. The reasons I put it here as well were that I thought people may like it, no one else had posted in the the Oriental section up to then and maybe someone at some point in the future might stumble across it with a little more info.

I know a couple of very experienced dealers in Chinese ceramics who will often find and buy 20C studio and European orientalist ceramics because of the similarities to thier main interest, they often ask my opinion on the studio pieces and I ask thiers of the Oriental pieces I find, in the process we all gain and learn, I would think that is at least part of the purpose of a forum like this.

It is of course a huge subject and what might be learnt here will no doubt be limited and perhaps superficial but it could act as a stepping stone and has the potential to lead to a greater understanding, after all the so called (and often self appointed) 'experts' started out knowing sweet FA just like everyone else.

I hope others will post here even if definitive answers are'nt immeadiatly forthcoming and that some specialists in this area will drop by and contribute in the future, as you've rightly said elsewhere this forum is currently very young.


Martyn.

[Pete]

Nice attitude Martyn
I was just being realistic about my own ambitions in this area as much as anything.
I sincerely hope it does play out the way you suggest. Sounds a nicer, gentler way than plunging oneself into the Gotheborg hothouse, which I considered and rejected because of other commitments and actually very few pieces of Oriental Ceramics. However I did read enough of the  articles to gain some appreciation of this vast and complex subject. I guess it scared me off somewhat. Silly really, as you say everyone has to start somewhere.
Thank you for this
Pete